GM CEO Mary Barra: We’re Pivoting Back to Hybrids
At an Automotive Press Association appearance on December 4, 2023, General Motors CEO Mary Barra said GM was considering bringing back hybrids. “We have the technology,” she said. “We’ll continue to look at where the market is, where the regulatory environment is.”
Now, market factors such as customer demand, problems with building electric models, and government pollution standards have caused Barra to admit that GM will begin building plug-in hybrids. Her comments came last Tuesday in a fourth-quarter earnings call with analysts.
She reiterated that GM is still on track to convert its portfolio to all-electric by 2035, as it promised in January 2021, “but in the interim, deploying plug-in technology in strategic segments will deliver some of the environmental benefits of EVs as the nation continues to build its charging infrastructure.”
She declined to say when we’ll see plug-in hybrids, or in which market segments GM will offer them. “We plan to deliver the program in a capital- and cost-efficient way because the technology is already in production in other markets. We’ll have more to share about this down the road.”
It’s lost on no one that GM had a leg up on plug-in hybrids with the Chevrolet Volt, which went on sale in December of 2010. The second-generation Volt, which had an upgraded powertrain and more battery capacity, went on sale in October of 2015. But GM pulled the plug on the slow-selling Volt in 2019 and began doubling down on plans to produce electric vehicles.
GM likely should have further refined a hybrid portfolio, as other manufacturers such as Toyota and Hyundai were doing, rather than dropping the technology altogether. “GM not only had a head-start on hybrids with the Volt but also with the SUVs more than a decade ago,” said Sam Fiorani, vice president for global forecasting for Pennsylvania-based AutoForecast Solutions. “Had they not decided on taking the all-EV route, they could have had a usable, and arguably more popular, hybrid lineup.
“The emissions regulations are going to require something more than the eventuality of electric vehicles,” he continues. “With the slowing transition to EVs, it makes sense to add hybrids to your lineup, especially since many of your products are V-8-powered trucks, and what are traditionally high-polluting models.”
Also in play is a “slowing of the transition to EVs,” Fiorani said. Early adopters jumped on EVs when they first became available, but the balance of customers have been more cautious about entering the EV market when they perceive that range and infrastructure may not be at the levels they require to abandon their ICE vehicles.
“Everybody anticipated that the growth would continue at this sharp angle, and it’s just not happening,” Fiorani said. “As we transition out of the early adopters, it’s been more difficult to move customers out of their ICE vehicles and into an EV.”
Indeed, simply building EVs and getting them to market has been difficult for GM, in part due to issues with weakened demand and with producing the Ultium battery platform. In a February forecast by AutoForecast Solutions, GM said it planned to build 416,300 EVs in 2023. Actual production was 120,900.
Presently, the Chevrolet Corvette E-Ray is the only hybrid in GM’s North American lineup. As Barra mentioned, GM builds hybrids in other markets, most notably China.
But Fiorani said that simply bringing the Chinese hardware and software here won’t solve GM’s problems. The Chinese hybrids are mostly smaller vehicles, and one issue will be finding a vehicle small enough in the U.S. fleet to use the same technology. “There’s a potential that they could use it in vehicles the size of the Chevrolet Trax, which is produced in South Korea. But the big meat will be hybrids that compete with Ford and Toyota in full-sized trucks.” Both Ford (as of the 2021 model year) and Toyota (as of 2022 MY) currently offer hybrid versions of their full-size trucks, and hybrid offerings in that segment would go a long way to helping GM meet emissions goals across its portfolio.
So when can we expect to see some new hybrids from GM? “This will not be an overnight thing,” Fiorano said, because GM will have to bring back engineering they haven’t used in a decade and raise it to current levels.
“It’s important to note that GM and the rest of the industry should have seen this coming,” Fiorani said, “and should have been better prepared. Toyota, Ford, Honda—a few of these companies have hybrids in their lineup, and companies like Toyota didn’t expect the transition to EVs to happen anytime soon. Something between those two extremes probably would have been the best course of action.”
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I have read many comments by many members of this forum over the past few years. I wish I’d kept count (not really) of how many of these people stated almost the exact same thing: “EVs are not ready yet, and hybrids are the way to go” (not exact quote, but you get the gist of it, right?). Which indicates to me that most commenters here are WAY smarter than the brass at GM and other automakers that have let the hybrid languish while charging full-ahead on all-electrics.
I congratulate and salute all of you who KNEW this long before GM (looking especially at hyperv6, who I know has championed hybrids over full EV in many of his responses).
Yup, PHEV is the way to go. Commute on electric, road trips on gasoline. It runs off of 110V electric wall plug. All good.
I actually argued Hybrids were better than BEVs with Hyper and his initial position was the change was inevitable, pushing back pretty forcefully. That said, if he softened his tone and is seeing the light good for him, but bottom line – EVs are part and parcel to the elimination of private vehicle ownership for most people.
For those that disagree, revisit Bob Lutz.
Lutz was probably the last GM person who knew anything about automobiles. Now things are run by bean-counters.
I like Lutz, but let’s remember that he’s also the guy who for years predicted that Tesla was inevitably headed toward bankruptcy!
Mary Barra, like her father, is a GM engineer. Barra began her career with GM in 1980 as a General Motors Institute (Kettering University) co-op student at the Pontiac Motor Division. She graduated with a Bachelor of Science degree in electrical engineering in 1985, followed by a Master of Business Administration from the Stanford Graduate School of Business in 1990. Prior to becoming CEO, Barra served as GM executive vice president, Global Product Development, Purchasing and Supply Chain since August 2013, and as senior vice president, Global Product Development since February 2011. In these roles, Barra and her teams were responsible for the design, engineering and quality of GM vehicle launches worldwide.
Previously, she served as vice president, Global Human Resources; vice president, Global Manufacturing Engineering; plant manager, Detroit-Hamtramck Assembly; and in several other executive engineering and staff positions.
Ok so she of all people should have known better than to fall under the spell of the government wet dream of total EV future, especially considering there’s little to NO EV infrastructure! But EVERYONE has access to at least a 110 plug in their garage, some even have 220! I was in the market for a new Volt, when Chevy pulled the plug, literally and figuratively! I could never own an EV, especially now that we are both retired and need only on vehicle. See we moved to Florida, have a new home with state of the art solar system, that for 3/4 the cost of an average summer electric bill, that’s all it costs for the life of the system, guaranteed for 30 years, or we get an automatic upgrade, all for the same amount, or less it technology advances. So an EV would be great, but long distance road trips, the ONLY adventure I out lives would have to stop, or get stressfully complicated with the issue of finding a charger after the first full charge, then at night in a motel. But a hybrid settles all that bs, with fantastic range and economy. My dream hybrid is a Chevy truck, as the owner of a fine 2019 trouble free Colorado Crew Cab 4×4 V6, the only improvement would be to add a hybrid drivetrain!!! I would be totally satisfied with a local transportation EV range of 35 miles daily with a fresh charge, then another 380 miles from the 20 gallon gas tank highway I get now! Please just keep it under $45k!
Nobody says that she isn’t smart, probably has an IQ off the charts, but not one once of common sense, just like the rest of the countries decision makers
Readers of this forum are all auto enthusiasts, what we used to call “car guys”. Back in the day GM was actually run by the people who loved cars and it spent a lot of effort recruiting talented people to make them. General Motors Institute, the Fisher Body Craftsmen’s Guild and the Parade of Progress were all created to find those people. By the mid seventies the writing was on the wall and it was made clear that the MBA was going to be the only path to corporate leadership and by 1981 the last of those programs (GMI) was divested. By 1990 they were hiring their top product people from Bausch and Lomb of all places! I’m not saying that there are no longer talented people at GM but there appear to be few decision makers in the mold of Ed Cole or Bob Lutz who can move the corporation’s products back to a leadership position.
EV have slowed because of the costs. People with upper class salaries have their new EV, also the range of travel, not to mention they have cold climate troubles are hampering sales. Bad timing for a product the public just doesn’t want..
Yes, the technology will continue to advance, however without low cost abundant electricity, the EV will fail. We here in California have less than 10% EV’s on the road and every summer we are told to turn off any extra AC device including EV’s to avoid blackouts.. If we double the number of EV’s here in CA, we will not be able to charge our vehicles and cool our food, we will have to choose one or the other. Without abundant and low cost power this whole discussion is really pointless.
I totally disagree that EV’s aren’t ready yet. The problem is chargers. With an inadequate charging infrastructure, we aren’t ready for EVs in the mass market. I don’t care if you build an EV for $15000, without chargers, they’re useless. If we were serious about converting from CE to EV, you would see tons of empty charging stations all along the freeway, but you don’t. An EV driver is faced with few chargers and long waits when they do find one that isn’t broken. This isn’t “Chicken/Egg”, it’s clearly “Egg”. Only so many people can afford a car that’s tethered to their own home charger. The “mass market” live in apartments.
GM appear to be rudderless in this and other areas, notably RHD as they are going back there after 4 years. Hybrid probably would have been the option, particularly for the truck line, but now they are still committed (this week anyway) to eliminating ICE by 2035. So look at the model cycle for vehicle and unless product planning has this in train today, it will be a couple of years before it will be available as they need to do all the testing to ensure it is viable as a long-term proposition.
So they will spend all this money converting a popular vehicle to hybrid for maybe 8 years of sales? A lot of time and effort going in to convincing people that they should buy a hybrid pick-up and then repeat that exercise again in 2035 to tell them that hybrid was bad and they should accept electric?
Setting aside what the consumer wants, does GM know what it wants to build?
GM know but the development stalled. Cost reduced for a number of years till just the last three on batteries.
I am perplexed. What is RHD? I am guessing you don’t mean “right hand drive”.
He does mean Right Hand Drive. GM said back in 2020 they weren’t going to build and right hand driver cars anymore:
https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1127140_gm-axes-holden-in-global-exit-from-right-hand-drive-markets
Not a fan of hybrids as they are the worst if both worlds.
#1 they cost more than most similar ICE models.
#2 they still require the same maintenance as any other ICE model.
#3 you still have a $1300 or more battery to replace.
#4 once the battery fails the resale tanks unless you invest to replace the battery.
#5 unless you come from a much larger vehicle your add fuel savings is not large.
#6 with the extra added cost of purchase and repair it will take a good while to recover the investment.
#7 make sure to plug many if these in or you will not save a thing.
Look GM like every other company was cutting cost on batteries till Covid hit. Since then the economy has stalled cost reduction. Due to this it requires them to put a smaller battery in to make an EV test cost less.
GM had looked at offering batter options in EV models do you could choose how much you pay much like how big of an engine you want for more power.
This deal is only a short term fix as we have no ICE laws in 2035 coming. Even if we can get the EPA yo back off 14 CARB regulated states are still out there with 44% of the market that can refuse to follow the EPA.
Also we have elections every 4 years and laws that can change faster than product planning.
People really still do not understand what is going on and the coming regulations. They point fingers at mfgs for the EV move when it is Washington.
They also do not understand the products. They hear the sales pitches but they fail to do the math. Most just struggle to set the programming of their dash let alone understand all about hybrids.
GM is looking to get people to experience EV at a lower price and like every other mfg hope yo get full EV models cheaper by the new law date killing ICE in 2035.
Between the coming laws and needed investments. The struggling auto industry and the unstable economy with high interest rates many automakers will struggle, merge, partner and yes some will fail.
I just watched a video on a Chevy hybrid truck. It was at an auction and cheap with low miles. It needed a battery. The battery was $4000. The labor to change it was 31 hours. Do the math on labor and itvwas more than they were asking for the truck. I saw the same thing on a Malibu hybrid.
The Prius is one of the few hybrids that the battery is lo vidt but it is still near $2000 for one yo be installed and it is a very small battery and short range.
The truth is the hybrid is a half a$$ ice and Half a$$ EV. But I get it they are trying to move people to accept these and still only be $3000 to $5000 over a ICE model.
The only hybrid to me that makes sense is the ERay and it is all about performance not emissions.
Even then I would avoid it due to the extra cost involved.
The folks in DC just need to back off and let the EV come when the cost are right forcing the issue is not going to make this work. Tesla has proven there are people who will buy. Let them for the bills till the cost come down. It may take a little longer but it would be much less painful on the buyers snd auto industry.
Contrary to Al Gore the world is still here and not going to burn up 20 years ago as he claimed.
FYI it will not take GM long to bring these models. They have the tech already. They just need to incorporate it into the models they choose.
For now I will drive ICE and if or when I have to I will just go EV. I have no interest in this band aid.
A couple counterpoints:
#5 unless you come from a much larger vehicle your add fuel savings is not large: Due to regenerative braking, city fuel economy is vastly improved over a non-hybrid, even for non-PHEVs.
#7 make sure to plug many if these in or you will not save a thing: As noted above, non-PHEVs still yield huge fuel efficiency gains.
Your points about cost, maintenance……agree. But for some, HEVs are perceived as a small, safer step than the big leap to full EV.
Perceived is the keyword.
Real world and variances will make true results variable like any other ICE or EV powered vehicle.
Your results may vary.
If you are all about saving trees it generally will improve emissions. But as for cost savings it is a boxed bag and savings is what most consumers are looking for.
Then you get the same arguments from som about pollution of battery production and the grid but those are not always honest arguments.
Like.
And lets face it, EVs are not ready for prime time unless you never drive far in a day. And even then, they have major problems in frigid weather.
There are a lot of people I’d call car busy-bodies, because they blame everything on cars. These people are probably responsible in no small part for the feds pushing BEVs before their time had come.
The feds would have done far better, as far as reducing global warming emissions, to push construction of new homes to require no heating or cooling (there’s such a house near me here in Massachusetts, that I wrote about more than 40 years ago). They could also have mandated installation of insulation in poorly insulated houses, which is a big help. I paid $2,500 to get my house insulated under a Massachusetts program; the state paid the other $7500, it’s greatly reduced the cost of my oil heat, as well as reduced noise generated outdoors.
And they could have mandated a good stiff carbon tax–both to encourage buying of high gas mileage cars and trucks (which would have also made the roads safer), and to encourage the use of more efficient equipment generally. But no, they just had to pick on cars!
FYI I just stumbled over this. Honda has similar points about their own Hybrids as I posted.
https://www.honda.co.uk/engineroom/cars/the-pros-and-cons-of-hybrid-cars/
We have a 2017 Volt and have saved a lot on fuel. When gasoline went up so much in 2021, we only drove the Volt and left my 2015 Regal in the garage with the 1999 Corvette. I think your evaluation is a bit harsh. I know folks were hoping we would be driving on electricity only by now, but the politicians failed to do any planning and the battery technology isn’t quite yet where it needs to be. The Volt’s technology eliminates range anxiety as long as you keep the fuel tank filled.
How much did you spend on the Electricity?
The range of many EVC models are 300 miles and would suit most drivers. The problem is the cost of the larger batteries. Your Volt Battery is not cheap and the EV of similar size is much more expensive.
What would be nice is for you to show how much you paid for the Volt. How much you spent on gas and Electric. How much was spent on oil changes and maintenance.
Also if you sold the car how much you got of for it.
I do not believe too harsh to point out that they half and half cars really are not about saving money. A similar Cruise would have been cheaper and likely cost about the same to operate over 5 years.
I do agree and place much of the problem on the political folks who are pushing agenda much harder than affordability and development time.
In time they will get there but like curing cancer you can not put a clock on it or in this case calendar.
The Volt was a very well engineered car–a triumph of American engineering. It’s too bad they didn’t keep producing it.
I agree it was a nice car but the truth is there was no money in it. GM built it and under priced it to sell. It was an expensive car to build.
The problem is too few people bought it.
Like the Camaro if it made money and sold in great numbers they would have continued to sell it.
They can make more money selling a Trax vs this and that is why they just paid a dividend in a year where they faced many obstacles.
Many like to point out they gave up on the Impact but it was never intended to be a long term model as it was pretty basic, range limited and again they leased it as no one would pay the real price.
I believe Ford is planning to offer their PowerBoost hybrid drivetrain on certain models of the F-150 as a no cost option.
OK, this is coming from a former Volt (and current Kia phev) owner:
#1 they cost more than most similar ICE models – No debate here. they do.
#2 they still require the same maintenance as any other ICE model. – While the ICE does still require maintenance, it does so MUCH less than a strictly ICE car. In the 8 years we owned our Volt, we had the oil changed 4 times, and that was because I didn’t want to leave it in longer than that, not because the “oil life” notification was on
#3 you still have a $1300 or more battery to replace. – Battery replacement getting cheaper all the time, and PHEV’s have smaller batteries to replace.
#4 once the battery fails the resale tanks unless you invest to replace the battery. – Like #1 above, no argument here. Unless it is to just not get in that situation. We, however did get our asking price when we traded the Volt in.
#5 unless you come from a much larger vehicle your add fuel savings is not large. – Here is where I gotta disagree the most. The Volt only needed to be filled with gas about 3 times a year (and just once between Mar-Oct) despite being driven daily by my wife to/from work. Cost to charge it up nightly was about $1 a day.
#6 with the extra added cost of purchase and repair it will take a good while to recover the investment. – Repair wasn’t an issue for us. Only repairs done were under warranty. And Like I said earlier we got what we wanted for it, trade-in wise.
#7 make sure to plug many if these in or you will not save a thing. – Hey, it did/does happen from time to time, but if you buy an electric vehicle, and don’t plug it in, neither I, or anyone else can help you!
I’m not saying PHEVs or EV’s are for everyone. We have family who live VERY rural. No way they could do electric. Have to drive to far, and their electric is too unreliable. Our use case is, admittedly, perfect for an EV or PHEV. My wife has like a 36 mile daily round trip, and a garage (Sitting next to my Miata, while the Pilot sits outside in the cold!) to park, and plug it in. they aren’t for everyone, but for those of us who are, they are very nice.
Hi Brian, My sister lives rural (not that rural) and drives a Tesla. Because she has solar panels on the roof of her house it is very easy and cheap for her. Indeed here in Australia it is the first time rural people can get cheaper energy in their vehicle than city people. As you say, it isn’t for everyone.
I agree they are not for everyone and results and satisfaction can vary.
You appear to be one that is willing to take the bad for the good. That is fine.
Statements like you got in trade what you wanted… But compared to an ICE model how does that compare. You give no numbers to show it was as good, equal or better. Also how much did you pay as many Volts were discounted to where they made lower trade easier to accept.
The oil really should be changed at least once a year just due to weather conditions and condistation Hybrid or ICE.
Look I am a GM guy and I do not dislike the Volt. I find it interesting but in the real world terms it is not the problem solver for the Automakers.
Another factor is these cars were sold for little profit. It still does not resolve the issues for the automakers.
With Emission being cut more and pending killing of the ICE they are facing major challenges.
GM as a whole has remained fluid to sell ICE as long a they can but still into EV models. But now they have had to alter the strategy. Yet they still plan a new V8. The truth is they can afford to do more than most companies. But this can only go on so long. The government needs to get it together with realistic plans that will not damage the automakers and the consumers pocket.
Stellantis Has even more baked in EV models and last month came off one of the worst they have had with the increase in prices to pay for it all. They are in a bad way and Ford is very cash poor right now. They all are going to face issues. Accept the Chinese. They do as they please. But that is another problem unto its self.
It’s all good. Did the Volt cost (a lot) more than a Cruze? You know it! (We did buy my son a Cruze two years after getting the Volt, so…) We had recently gotten an inheritance, or otherwise we couldn’t have afforded it. Which is probably why we are in a Kia PHEV, now. Nothing wrong with it, either, “it’s fine” as my wife says, just not as nice or well equipped as the Volt was. Trouble was, the volt was 8 years old so now totally out of warranty, and we could use another tax break, so it got traded. I didn’t mention the numbers, because that was 4 years ago now, and I don’t remember. But, my point was we were happy with what we got in trade, which is really the important part. (Believe me, I have walked out of dealerships for “insulting” me with their trade offer.)
I’d like for PHEVs or EVs to be less expensive all the way around, because I have a feeling that of our cars, at least the one she drives will be one, from now on. She is spoiled not having to go to the gas station anymore.
I get it that the manufacturers are in a bind. We’ve been told the “future” is electric, but very few people are buying them, even with discounts. It’s kind of a Catch-22. The tech to improve EVs requires money to develop, but why spend that money if no one is going to buy EV’s!
The real question is who will blink first. The Goverment or the people.
In the mean time we have two Blazers. Two Equinox etc as GM is waiting to see who wins.
The Green agenda people have no worries about the automakers or economy. They are happy if it crashes. At times I feel that is their goal.
The manufacturers are definitely caught in a tight spot, trying to reconcile what the government dictates with what the consumer is willing to buy. I wouldn’t bet against the consumer.
BTW, Toyota Prius are the great favorite of taxi and ride app companies. I know of many operators clocking over 300k miles on the original battery. If reliability were an issue, these vehicles would not be so popular.
Priuses have generally been highly reliable, and highly efficient.
Thank you for seeing the big picture.
Yes the Prius is the most effective but it also is the one with one of the smallest batteries. That is key for cost and reliability. Larger the model the larger the battery the $$ dynamics change just as with EV models with even larger batteries.
A local repair shop used a Gen II Prius for their passenger pickup vehicle. They didn’t know how many miles it had on it, because the odomoter stopped counting at 300,000! (Apparently a Toyota thing – it also happened to my sister-in-law’s Pontiac Vibe.)
Note again the 2035 going no ICE is a federal and Carb law. Not an option by the mfgs a law they are forced to meet.
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-pledges-end-gas-powered-federal-vehicle-purchases-by-2035-2021-12-08/
Note even Europe is now considering backing off their regulations as of October.
Please read up on the many moving parts of this and understand who is forcing what.
Uh, that article (from 2021) says the federal government will quit buying ICE cars for itself. It doesn’t say you can’t buy one. In fact, it expressly points out that the current administration is against any law to end sales of ICE vehicles by any particular date, and more recent articles confirm this to still be the case.
Mike here
https://www.hagerty.com/media/news/house-passes-a-bill-that-could-prolong-ice-powered-vehicle-sales/#:~:text=The%20bill%20is%20in%20response,and%20hydrogen%20fuel%2Dcell%20vehicles.
The EPA is dragging their feet on this but after the election this year you will see them move forward if Biden remains in office.
The Carb states have already approved their move and even if the EPA says no they were supported by a SCOTUS decree that they could ban even against federal laws.
This is all so very political.
https://www.summitracing.com/legislative-alerts
These are laws set to counter the EPA but they are not moving fast.
https://www.sema.org/epa-news
This one is where the EPA is trying to reinterpreted the laws in their own way. The RPM act is needed to make sure the EPA changes nothing on their own.
No matter how you look at it thes are all to fight the changes and forcing of EV products by the government. The Automakers really are not the ones pushing these. it is a reaction.
These are called legislative platitudes.
We don’t have enough grid capacity, nor enough plants in the permitting process, to get enough capacity online to address the demand spike for 2035 new vehicle sales. It took Georgia Power nearly 20 YEARS to expand a nuke plant, that’s after the permitting was approved.
Forget about coal or natural gas plant.
There isn’t enough demand for plastics to offset the petroleum distillates not used for gasoline and diesel – there will be a massive disposal issue.
Take a look at a 2014 Tesla Model S vs a 2024. It is pure Hopium to believe that tech will make the leap, when incremental improvements have been extremely minimal.
The majority bridge is ICE and Hybrid.
EPA can ban what they want, but the MASSIVE costs will be borne by the voting public.
Case in point – our municipality has an all electric Bus and Fire Medical Engine. The Bus is out of service due to battery range and maintenance, the Fire Medical truck died on scene and had to be rescued by a motor pool employee who towed out a very large diesel generator trailer, behind an ICE pickup.
Realville will quickly make these ridiculous proclamations to be the rambling machinations of apparatchiks.
Don’t trust gm on anything they say as Mary makes big predictions then pulls back. gm is in big trouble with all the huge losses with Cruise and the injuries. I would’nt own the stock either.
This is a very fluid market and automakers are trying to leverage Tech to boost stock prices. That is why they all are going to the Consumer Electric Show now.
The interesting thing about plug-in hybrids is that few motorists ever use the plug-in feature. So why build them??? Just to get CAFE mpg credits? The smart approach now for GM would be to keep doing business as usual (big expensive over-priced gas & diesel trucks), then make the change to EVs when the next generation battery technology is ready (next 2 to 3 years) and the charging infrastructure is in place (next 2 to 3 years).
Would you dare park any hybrid in your garage? The questionable fire risk from their batteries (to me) means they are best parked out by the curb, or in a parking lot, away from combustibles, and downwind from any humans.
ICE cars catch fire too. Do you not park your ICE car in the garage? There is no evidence that EV cars catch fire more than ICE cars do.
Cell phones catch fire too. Have you stopped carrying your phone in your pocket?
A cell is not going to burn down the house.
Haven’t heard of any modern ICEs self immolating. Have about EVs.
Not for me.
A cell phone might not burn down your house but I’ll bet it will burn you if it catches fire in your pants. That’s why I asked: “Have you stopped carrying your phone in your pocket?” Maybe you missed the last word of that question.
As for EV first, do some research. EV’s are actually LESS likely to catch fire than ICE cars. Educate yourself before passing on misinformation.
https://www.autoweek.com/news/a38225037/how-much-you-should-worry-about-ev-fires/
https://www.motortrend.com/features/you-are-wrong-about-ev-fires/
@NovaResource in my view the article isn’t giving the EV a clean bill of health. The evaluation appears a little skewed.
Have a look at this video below. Once these have a short, the results are very violent and challenging to extinguish.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBUGEFErXxA
I agree that they are best parked away from your sleeping family.
Your comment about ICE cars sometimes catching fire reminds me of an article I read in a classic car magazine several years ago, I can’t remember which one. The title of the article was, more or less, “How to Install a High Tech Fire Suppression System in Your Garage.” The subtitle was, more or less, “If you park a British car in your garage, this is mandatory.”
Actually more ICE catch fire as for the simple fact there just so many more of them alone. So use care using others talking points.
The other thing is the news never covers every Camry Fire but any Tesla in a 1000 miles catches it is all over the web. Coverage is not equal.
I think it’s all about the next generation of drivers, brought up in the save the planet world. My daughter bought a VW i4, found out she couldn’t reliably make it 2 hours out to ski, find a working charger, and make it home without major hassle and delays. Sold it back to the dealer, and bought a Hyundai Tucson hybrid. Next ski trip, she was stuck in snowstorm traffic for 8 hours. I shudder to think what would have happened in the i4.
Not a good argument. ICE cars use gasoline while sitting in traffic, EV’s don’t use electricity when not moving (yes, I know, they will use some electricity generating heat for the passengers). It’s probably just as likely to run out of gas sitting in an 8-hour traffic jam as it is to run out of electricity.
Adding 2 gallons of fuel would net another 50-60 miles of range in minutes.
Et Tu, Brute?
There is no charger properly placed between my house and the cabin.
Plenty of fuel stations.
If you are a true believer, maybe invest in charging stations with C-stores?
How would you add 2 gallons of fuel while in an 8-hour traffic jam?
Then fall, Caesar.
No charger stations? How many fuel stations were around in 1900 at the beginning of ICE cars? Give it time. The infrastructure just hasn’t been built yet.
I wouldn’t call myself a true believer. I just haven’t closed my mind to the subject.
Not all ICE use gas in traffic. My car stops.
But the use or gas savings at idles is small in traffic.
I suspect that GM was driven to EVs by 1) US government subsidies/payoffs, 2) US government threats and nothing to do with market demand
nah, their motivation was Tesla’s insane market cap; everybody wants their stock to trade for 20X book value as it makes for big bonuses and lucrative stock options. The MBAs who run the big automakers figured jumping head first into EVs was the ticket to doing that
They would like that to happen but the truth is the pending government puah is driving this. GM could make much more money with ICE models.
GM always seems to gain the mindset of “ They’ll buy whatever we build” and then reacts with astonishment when public does not accept being force fed.
Add to that the giant sucking leech named UAW and you have a perfect recipe for another government bail-out.
Bravo!!!
Actually GM is building everything if you had not noticed.
They have a gas Blazer and EV. They have a Gas Equinox and a EV one. Silverado Gas and EV. They are hedging their bets and covering them. They take nothing for granted.
GM used to build it and they will come. But that is where they got into trouble. They have finally learned.
I’ve owned Cadillacs for nearly 44 years and recently test drove the new Lyriq. I was pleasantly surprised and very impressed, but I’m not ready for an electric car yet. I think we are a “Battery Generation” or two away from an electric car that is ready for prime time. In the meantime, I think hybrids are reasonable bridge. If Cadillac offered a hybrid that met my needs, I would seriously consider it.
GM missed the boat again or should I say sunk the boat and now paddling in the life raft. They were
ahead of everyone with the Volt but didn’t see the gold mine in front of them. Corporate didn’t back the Volt, the dealers didn’t understand the technology, so surprise surprise, they didn’t sell. I went in multiple Chevy dealers looking at Volts to find them in the back and not plugged in. Guess what…….dead traction battery. So could not drive in electric mode for test drive. Best way to kill a model.
the Volt’s design makes a lot more sense than an EV as the on board charging engine weighs and costs less than a high capacity battery necessary for long range driving and you also avoid the drama of finding a charging station on the road. I was kind of surprised it didn’t sell better but of course most people only care about economic cost of use when fuel is extraordinarily expensive and gasoline wasn’t during its production life.
Perhaps a proof-read before send?
Personally I feel hybrid cars are backwards. Hybrid cars should be like trains. Trains have been diesel/electric for years but they run on electric motors only. The diesel engine is just used to generate electricity. Cars should be fully electric and have a small ICE engine just to generate additional electricity as needed to charge the battery for longer trips.
That’s the way a 2nd Gen Volt works … As a hybrid, you gas it up, but only electricity propels it forward. The little ICE is just recharging the battery, supplemented by regenerative braking. The Volt was the right idea but they gave up at an inopportune time.
The automakers need to reverse the trend away from cars to SUVs and CUVs. No matter what the power train, taller, heavier vehicles are going to use more energy, and thus pollute more, and cost more to operate.
They (the automakers) cry that all people is buy is SUVs and CUVs — yeah, I guess that will be true when that is all that is on offer.
Wagons such as the Golf Sportwagon, and many others that are still available elsewhere in the world offer just as much cargo space as small-to-midsize SUVs while having lower consumption, and much easier roof-rack access for carrying things like bicycles, kayaks and canoes. AWD wagons exists (Audi, VW, BMW, Subaru). One does not need a tall, heavy SUV to get AWD.
My wife bought a brand new 2013 PriusV (the one that looked like a station wagon) to replace her ‘06 Mazda Tribute V6 (aka Ford Escape w/a tuned suspension) to improve her work commute gas mileage. The PriusV provided the same passenger and cargo space, plus almost double the gas mileage. We were thrilled, didn’t need to plug anything into anything else, and continued to plan our many road trips w/out worrying about charging station locations. Here’s the thing: We WANTED to make that purchase. No one can tell me that using half the gasoline for the same road miles didn’t shrink our “carbon footprint” either. Toyota had the hybrid pretty much perfected … 11 years ago. They still sell a ton of hybrids across all the car (and TRUCK) lines they produce. And full-ICE, and PHEV, and full-electric vehicles. They offer their customers a choice. . When full-electric cars are ready, we’ll know it because buyers will want to buy more of them. Meanwhile, give your customers a choice, and the market will sort itself out. It’s called market capitalism. Works everywhere it’s been tried.
I don’t trust batteries in the winter. The ev battery runs the drive train, defroster, heater, wipers, rear defogger,
radio, gps, heated seats etc. I want some sort of backup in case my battery dies in a snowstorm or other fiasco like a traffic jam on the highway. Hybrids I think are the answer. My friend has a Ford Hybrid and loves it. I also worry about the power grid supplying our electricity. I also think power costs will rise significantly because fuel taxes help maintain our roads. The money has to come from somewhere if we are not buying fuel. Right now I’m glad I’m older and going out of this world not just getting into it.