The Montana License Plate Loophole, Explained
If there’s anything more American than apple pie, it’s our aversion to taxes. We hate ’em, and Americans—especially the wealthy ones—are on an unceasing quest to pay as little in taxes as humanly and (hopefully) legally possible. It’s precisely because of this desire to stick it to the tax man that we so often see Montana license plates—on supercars at Cars and Coffee, high-end classics on the road, or RVs at a state park—even if they’re 2000 miles from Big Sky Country and their owners have never set foot there.
There’s a certain legal loophole from our 41st state. It lets you avoid the taxes, fees, and DMV dealings of registering a vehicle in your own state, saving headaches and potentially tens of thousands of dollars in the process. It seems like a great deal, but there’s more to it than that. Proponents of this loophole will call it tax avoidance, which is perfectly legal. Others might call it tax evasion, which isn’t. As Montana plates have gotten both more popular and more notorious in recent years, some states are cracking down. A case from California grabbed attention this summer, but people with Montana plates have gotten in trouble from coast to coast. So, what is this Montana loophole/scheme/scam/whatever-you-wanna-call-it? How does it work? And what is the current state of things for this collector car life-hack?
How It Works: Haven’t You Always Wanted a Company Car?
If you’ve just purchased a $300,000 Lamborghini, McLaren, or motorhome, and plan to keep and use it in the state where you reside, you’ll need to pay sales tax in that state. In Texas, that can be up to 8.25 percent. In California, it can be over 10, and in Louisiana over 12. There are also registration fees and, depending on where you live, safety inspections and emissions testing. But wait, there are other extras, too. In Massachusetts, for example, there is “motor vehicle excise tax,” an annual bill calculated at $25 per $1000 of your vehicle’s value, determined by the “percentage of the manufacturer’s list price in the year of manufacture.” Georgia has a “Title Ad Valorem Tax” (TAVT), which is a one-time payment at 7 percent of the “fair market value” of the vehicle at time of registration, and California has an annual “Vehicle License Fee” (VLF) based on the vehicle’s value as well.
All of the above are by far the least enjoyable part of a car purchase. The Montana loophole is one way to get around it. It’s much, much cheaper. We’re talking hundreds of dollars instead of potentially tens of thousands. It’s simpler, too. It really can be easier to register a vehicle halfway across the country than it is at your DMV down the street.
Every state has a different tax structure, with some elements more attractive than others. Texas and Florida, for example, have no state income tax. Montana (along with Alaska, Delaware, New Hampshire, and Oregon) has no sales tax. But Montana also doesn’t have state vehicle safety or emissions inspections. There are no use or excise taxes, either. For vehicles 11 years old or older, you can even get a permanent registration there. No renewals necessary. To get a Montana title/registration/plate in your name you’d still need to be a Montana resident, but what you can do instead is form a limited liability company (LLC) that is technically domiciled in Montana, and have that LLC buy and register the vehicle. Then you have your own company car, MT plates and all, to drive around along with thousands of extra bucks in your bank account. The car never needs to turn a wheel in Montana, or even in the same time zone.
Sounds complicated, but it really isn’t. A Montana LLC doesn’t have to sell, make, or even do anything, really. You could form it solely for the purpose of registering a car to save you money. You could even register more cars under that same LLC without having to form a new one. And while there are some complications and paperwork on the Montana side of things, there are plenty of people in that state who are more than happy to help you, for a small fee.
There’s a whole cottage industry of firms in Montana (many are law firms, but not all) that will act as your “resident agent” or “registered agent” and will form the LLC, register the vehicle, and act as the Montana-based agent for your company as required by state law. These firms have catchy names like “$1 Montana,” “All Day $49 Montana,” “Montana Tags” and “LLC TLC,” just to name a few. The websites for such firms promise a smooth and quick process, with one even playing on upper-class aspirations with language like, “it’s time to play with the rules the rich created.”
There’s enough business to go around, apparently. According to reporting by Montana newspaper The Missoulian, 30,000 LLCs were registered there in 2021. To be fair, not all of those were for vehicle registrations, but compare that to Oregon, where fewer than 55,000 LLCs were registered in the same period despite Oregon having quadruple the population.
Problems and Pitfalls
For Montana, the whole non-resident LLC and car registration thing works out great. The state pulls in revenue from vehicle registrations, but they’re from vehicles that never enter the state. They don’t wear down Montana roads. They don’t pollute Montana air. It’s also all perfectly legal from Montana’s point of view. And “The Treasure State” is bringing in a lot of, well, treasure. As of 2023, vehicle registrations were the fourth largest source of tax revenue in Montana for the state general fund.
Not all of that comes from non-residents but, unsurprisingly, Montana has more vehicles registered per capita than any other state, by a long way. Montana has a population of 1.123 million, barely more than itty-bitty Rhode Island, but according to Bureau of Transportation Statistics data, as of 2021 Montana has nearly twice as many vehicles registered as it does human beings. At more than 1.9 vehicle registrations per person, Montana’s rate is well over twice the national average of 0.85 vehicles per person.
The problems with the Montana loophole arise when vehicles registered there run afoul of the laws in the states where those vehicles are actually kept and used. For many states, once a vehicle is within its borders for 30 days, it legally needs to be registered and titled there, fees and all. If you live, buy, and keep a vehicle in a state with sales tax, then sales tax must be paid. If you use a Montana LLC and drive your car on MT plates, then, your state has missed out on tax revenue that could be going to the roads, schools, parks, and other infrastructure that you, a resident, use and enjoy.
On the other hand, using the Montana loophole is more defensible in the world of actively used RVs, where Montana plates are popular because a nice motorhome can cost as much as a house. Their owners may not physically reside or keep the RV in one state full-time, so individual state registration requirements may not apply. Otherwise, a more legally supportable way to use the Montana loophole is if the vehicle is stored in a state other than the owner’s residence, and if it never stays in their resident state long enough for that state’s legal residency requirements kick in. As far as insurance issues go, it’s best to follow the law and, when in doubt, consult with an attorney.
The loophole doesn’t just strain other states. There are actually some pitfalls back in Montana, too. Clerks at smaller counties there have gotten overwhelmed trying to process an influx of non-resident car registrations. “We were getting backlogged, especially during tax season”, a county attorney in Anaconda told The Missoulian last year, and that a local company “would send in a secretary with 100 of these vehicles to be registered. So we ran into a situation where we’re not going to register 100 vehicles while people stack up behind you and normal people wait.”
The company even sued, wanting an order from the district court to handle registrations in an “expeditious manner.” There are also reports that at one time Missoula County had a full-time staff member dedicated to nothing but non-resident vehicle registrations. In 2021, Montana even saw its license plate production disrupted due to an aluminum shortage. Supply chain shakeups from the pandemic got most of the blame, but shipping thousands of new plates out of state can’t have helped matters, either.
Risks and Crackdowns
Several major crackdowns on owners with Montana plates, slapped with major fines and back taxes, have made headlines. Given the small number and seemingly erratic nature of enforcement from the states, it seems like the chances of getting in trouble are pretty low, but John Draneas, attorney and author of the “Legal Files” column at Sports Car Market, feels otherwise: “I think it’s a mistake to say the risk of getting caught is low. If you think about it, any time the DMV or the cops want to, they could go to any big car gathering in Southern California and bust God knows how many people.” Indeed, Draneas feels that the risk of using the Montana loophole is getting higher, as the scheme has become more well-known. “Any kind of special-interest or collector car with a Montana plate, it’s pretty obvious what you’re doing. You’re exposed if you ever take that car out in public,” he says.
And you’re not just exposed if the authorities happen to be around. California Highway Patrol, which points out that the state “loses millions of dollars a year in revenue from California residents who register their vehicles in other states,” has a program in which anyone can report out-of-state plates to the authorities (Colorado and Arizona have similar systems).
Draneas recently covered a case in California, in which an owner had a California state investigator and two sheriff’s deputies show up to his house with a search warrant authorizing them to search his garage (where he kept his Montana-plated sports car) and seize his cell phone. They told him he was violating a California law requiring him to register his car in the state and pay a use tax, and to expect penalties and charges to follow. There are reportedly a number of other California residents under investigation for the same thing, “all by the same state investigator, who is said to have a strong personal interest in combating Montana-licensed cars.” And these are just ones we’ve heard about. Enforcement may be more common than we realize because, as Draneas points out, “people don’t talk about it much when they get caught.”
Other notable crackdowns include one in late 2018, when the Georgia Department of Revenue compiled a list of cars that had a Peach Pass (Georgia’s toll road tag) but also had Montana registrations, then built profiles of where the cars had been and how long they had been in Georgia. The investigation and subsequent crackdown then focused on two individuals who had dozens of cars registered with Montana LLCs, and the lead investigator notes that monitoring the cars’ appearances on social media played a pivotal role in building a case.
Back in 2010, Massachusetts cracked down on Montana-plated RVs. The state’s Office of the Inspector General, Department of Revenue, and Registry of Motor Vehicles (RMV) “investigated a small sample of RVs purchased with Montana LLCs . . . the preliminary investigation has collected nearly $200,000 and led to enforcement action that has billed errant taxpayers for hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes and fees.” The investigation identified 23 Montana LLCs with 32 vehicles registered to them, and at the time cited that Montana had an LLC for every 19 residents in that state, while Massachusetts only had an LLC for every 83 residents. Two years before that, in Colorado, the Attorney General’s Office and Revenue Department obtained misdemeanor tax evasion convictions against 12 RV-owning residents who had used the Montana loophole to avoid paying Colorado taxes, and the Revenue Department took civil action on more than 100 other residents for a total of $2.7M in unpaid sales taxes, penalties, and interest.
Ten years ago, a court case in Louisiana regarding the Montana loophole, Thomas v. Bridges, made news. Thomas had formed a Montana LLC, solely to avoid sales tax in Louisiana (the nation’s highest) on an RV he purchased in that state for $351,800. By doing that he avoided paying over $30K in taxes and fees to his home state. He also kept the RV at a property he owned in another state, Mississippi. The Louisiana Department of Revenue went after him (but not his LLC, crucially) for unpaid taxes, a total of $46,509.60 including penalties. Thomas eventually brought the matter before a Louisiana district court, which ruled in Thomas’ favor. The case went all the way up the chain to the Louisiana Supreme Court, which also found in Thomas’ favor, as the Department of Revenue’s case was against him personally, and not his LLC, which technically bought and owned the RV. However, two of the justices concluded with calls for legislative action that would address the use of out-of-state LLCs to avoid taxes on purchases made in Louisiana.
Shouldn’t We All Just Pay Our Taxes?
Like the kids say, we live in a society.
Look, nobody likes taxes. Yes, the tax structure in some states can be nonsensical, unfair, and downright infuriating. Yes, having to get your vehicle inspected, and repair something if it fails, is annoying. Yes, saving 10 percent or more on a six-figure purchase has a heck of a lot of appeal. But being frustrated with the tax code and local laws doesn’t make anyone special, and it doesn’t exempt anyone from the laws in their state.
Taxes are necessary. How governments collect and spend those taxes is another conversation and can be addressed, however imperfectly, through voting and legislation. But if enough expensive vehicle owners use some loophole to get out of paying taxes in their state it could, theoretically, result in more taxes on everyone else. Plus, sales taxes are regressive by nature. Yes, Joe-Ferrari-buyer’s $20,000 tax bill is way higher than single-mom-Hyundai-buyer’s $2000 one. But that $20K extra for his occasional weekend toy is less of a burden to him than the extra $2K is to the lady who needs her Sonata to get to and from two jobs. And she’s not riding with Montana plates, is she?
When you make a big luxury purchase, be it a watch or a boat or a supercar, you’re supposed to factor in the cost of ownership (maintenance, storage, insurance, etc.), too. It’s not unreasonable to also expect people to factor in tax and registration fees. Especially in the world of exotic cars, where all those taxes and fees can be less than a tick or two on the options list, or the cost of a major service.
There are instances where it makes sense, and it’s easy to take advantage of, but for the most part the Montana loophole is hard to justify. It also appears to be getting riskier. The scheme is better known than ever. And, as everyone these days has a camera in their pocket and most are eager to post pictures of cool cars to social media, it’s more visible than ever, too. There can be clear benefits to the whole thing, as well as clear risks. As that old Latin saying goes, caveat emptor.
People around me complain about the cost of registration and plates in Illinois, but after reading this, we have it pretty easy.
Yep, just Illinois sales tax when you buy and $150/yr for regular license. Antique plates for cars 25+ years old are $25 for FIVE years.
And also in Illinois, one can get “Extended Antique” license for half of the full regular license price, and they are good for 9 months of the year; in Dec. thru Feb., they are equivalent in function to the true Antique plates.
The relatively low fees and taxes for cars in Illinois is rather surprising, given the political leaning of the state – and especially given the high property taxes overall, and particularly in some regions of the state.
Hey Joe! I have a 51 year old car in Illinois that I have been paying $150.00 a year for plates now for 12 years. Now $158.00 a year. Ya think they would tell me I should be paying. $25.00 for a 5-year plate? 😔😔😔🤨🤨🤨
It depends on your state laws. In NJ, ‘Historic’ plates are much less expensive, but put restrictions on the use of the car. So, if you are using your 51 year old car as a daily driver, it would not qualify for Historic plates in NJ.
Wow, our law is a same year year plate is 35 bucks lifetime. ‘ve had mine on my Shelby for decades now. My Mach1 for 11 years. Great deal here in Mi. A historical is 30 bucks for 10 years.
Antique or historical plates in Missouri for vehicles 25 years old or older are just $25 and are permanent, staying on the vehicle as long as you own it.
Mike, I married an Illinois girl (still married) and moved to Lisle with California registration on my car. Police pulled me over and explained that California cars are stolen and brought to Illinois for sale or parting out. Ok. I changed to Illinois registration.
I hated the winter so we moved back to California but transitioning for a while, and on the evening news came a story about how California is cheated out of revenue by out of state registrations. The next day I was stopped on the 5 freeway and the officer claimed that I was weaving. Huh? Later that day I was stopped again. Why? Officer said that I was weaving. I protested but was ignored. The next day I was stopped again ….. why? I was weaving. Now we all know that this was a lie and I told the third officer this and she went away.
We have thirty days to register cars in the home state and I wasn’t even moved yet …… but it costs the state more to pursue and collect than the potential revenue. The Board of Equalization tracks planes by acquiring free registration data from the FAA. I imagine it tracks cars when a ticket is issued to an out of state registered vehicle.
Montana requires evidence of residency before it will issue a registration, as well as vehicle insurance. As for an LLC, there is Montana income tax, so federal and state tax returns must be filed as well as having an agent for service. That would not be cheap.
I reckon this article makes a mountain out of a molehill ….. in Montana everyone has at least one vehicle because they have to. Pick up trucks usually, and a family sedan. It’s so spread out that people need a vehicle and a spare just to survive in the winters.
Actually it’s cheap to do an LLC – less than $700. No taxes and the company handles all paperwork for that coast.
If a person sets up the LLC in Montana on their own it’s only $35. And the state has waived annual filing fees for the past several years (although it’s only $25 normally). I love the picture of the white Ferrari – it’s registered in my county – Lewis and Clark County.
In Illinois cars over 10 years old and under $15,000 have a flat sales tax of $150. That’s how I save my money, buy old cars.
Our taxes must not be too bad as I have not seen it in Ohio. But I have seen a number of Montana plates in California. Now I know why.
Ohio does not have an annual vehicle tax, unlike some neighboring states where you pay every year based on your vehicle’s “value”. It’s hundreds of dollars on a new or nice car.
Yes I’m aware. Taxes in CA are horrible. That is why so many people keep an older low value car yo save money.
Ca. resident for over 52 years. You are what you drive. No one drives a dog car, can’t afford the bad image.
That would be Michigan. Vehicle tax used to be based on weight of the vehicle, which makes sense to me – more weight means more wear and tear on the roads, and the plate fee was originally supposed to pay for road maintenance. And “value” is based on original MSRP, not current depreciated value as far as I can tell.
I have an old Mercedes Benz 300 SL in Michigan that I drive less than 2000 miles per year. Plates were $385 per year which is more than the insurance. So this year I got vintage plates for $30 good for ten years!
Find a model-year plate and it costs $35 for the life of the car.
I’d heard of this “loophole” but didn’t really know much of the details. This is an in-depth, revealing piece, written just to educate – not encourage. Thanks, Andrew!
“Yes, having to get your vehicle inspected, and repair something if it fails, is annoying.” Uh? If it’s a safety issue isn’t that really important? Safety for you, or safety for other road users…
Do you really think that people that go through the trouble of setting up an LLC in Montana are doing so to avoid maintaining their cars?
Hey Nick. I know two people locally who went the Montana LLC route to avoid bringing their European sports cars up to California emission standards. It could be done but they are both just cheap.
My son bought a Nissan Skyline while deployed in Japan that can be legally imported since it is just over 25 years old.
He currently is in Hawaii and is registering it there. But when he comes back to California I’m fully expecting that there will be no method or allowance for him to legally register it in California.
If California refuses to register it and refuses to accept his money, then we will investigate registering it in Nevada or Arizona. Sometimes California is it’s own worst enemy.
Emissions and safety standards are two completely different things. Case in point, in New Jersey there is no longer ANY safety inspection of any kind for any car, just emissions. New car, old car, trailer queen or jalopy – as long as your check engine light isn’t on and you pass emissions, you can pass with a completely cracked windshield, no taillights, missing headlight, bald tires and brakes with barely any brake pads left on them. Seriously. And cars with historic plates never need to be inspected.
That must be very new. When I took my Tacoma down to Eatontown for inspection three years ago, they checked all the lights and checked brakes. I had it done at a private garage last year, and he checked everything.
NJ no longer requires inspection for pre-OBD-II cars either.
Not necessarily maintaining, but if you have a 2009 diesel truck that doesn’t pass emissions you can put Montana plates on it, as there are no emission requirements in Montana. Also, you can get permanent Montana plates if your vehicle is over 11 years old(1 time registration)
What about insurance? I imagine, to be valid, it must correspond with your actual residence/driving?
Great question! Awaiting Hagerty’s answer…
I have never been asked for my vehicle’s state of registration when applying for insurance. Come to think of it, I have never even been asked to prove my vehicle was registered in any state. Only the state where the vehicle is garaged.
I recently read an article about insurance companies pushing back on claims for accidents in NJ/NY when they were told the vehicles were domiciled in MT. Not sure who won
I am an insurance agent, not a Hagerty employee so I am not speaking for them. I am only speaking as an agent ( independent but that does has no relevance to my response). While most insurance companies do not ask what state a car is registered in , it may very well create questions if there is a claim, especially a total loss. Insurance laws vary state to state, for example an insurance policy in New Jersey cannot be sold to somone in Montana or vise versa. The car should be insured in the state it resides in, period. In fact I’ve never seen an insurance accept alternate garaging in another state. So while it may not be “illegal” it does create a gray area. We advise our clients to avoid gray areas. The only way that this can work without potentially creating a denied claim is if the person we’re to set up an address in Montana also and call it a secodary home. Of course when that claim comes in the person would be committing insurance fraud if they said that they we’re ” only visiting but live in Montana”. This is all just my opinion, I am not a lawyer nor am I an underwriter. Just a careful insurance agent
When I moved from Tennessee to New Jersey in 1984, I notified my insurance company of my new address. They had no problem with it – they simply increased my rates about $25 a year. The State, on the other hand, had a big problem with it, and said that I had to get insurance from a local New Jersey company. Since local companies were reluctant to take on new customers, that put me in a pool run by the State. My rates went up about $250 a year.
One other missed insurance item that hat can cause problems for owners of Montana LLCs is if a claim is made and the car has “personal auto insurance” and not a “business commercial” policy the claim can easily be denied since the car is supposed to be a “company” car. There also can be issues with explaining the business purpose and use of the car vs an occasional pleasure vehicle. Lots of easy ways to get caught.
I think insurance and license would be like working for a legit company based in Montana and they provide you a company car. You still insure it and have a license as a Georgia (or where ever) resident but the Montana Division of Innitech owns it.
What I want to know: if Georgia is cracking down on these owners, what about all the companies (Coca Cola being one) who have trucks and trailers registered in Maine? Surely 88,000 pounds of soft drinks are doing more uncompensated damage to our roads than these 3,000 pound exotics that get driven 2,000 miles a year.
Usually the registration fees are split between the various States in which the truck operates. When this is the case, you usually see the word “apportioned” on either the plate or the vehicle (or both). Road repair is generally handled through taxes on fuel.
Insurance cares where the vehicle is stored/used, not registered.
Insurance is based on the type of vehicle and usage. A 2011 Porsche 911 driven 1000 miles a year would fit Hagerty, it would be insured in the registration state, knowing it’s garaged elsewhere, according to Hagerty guidelines. If that same Porsche is driven 10k miles a year, it would need to be insured in the garaging state, not registered state. If u have more questions we can answer those, reach out to us, Roger@insure406.com
Back in the 70s I lived in Montana and the cost of registration was pretty expensive I thought.I had to pay the back taxes from the last year the vehicle was last registered.Which was something like 8-10 years.I’ll stick with paying my $47 a year for personalized plate on my 55 year old classic here in Michigan and not worry about a knock on my door.
It’s very cheap now. I just paid the $200 annual fee for my 2019 pickup. My other two cars which are over 11 years and RV have permanent plates that will never cost another dime.
While a Classic car plate is cheap in Michigan, this is one of the states that also bases the registration fee on the car’s original MSRP. I learned this the hard way after buying a 12-year old Jaguar XJ-R for $9K and being charged an annual registration fee based on the car’s original $80K price!
FYI, we don’t go backwards on registration (Montana) any longer – unless it is during the one year period.
Same deal for me in New Jersey, when I woke my Triumph up after many years working on it.
How do they know you didn’t purchase it from out of state? Would be cheaper to retitle in another state then “bring” it back in.
Very interesting.
Did not know about that.
Besides the various unpaid ‘taxes’ mentioned in the article above => another similar issue in Massachusetts has been ‘unpaid parking tickets’, especially when written for cars with ‘out-of-state plates’ – with the concern apparently being that the use of a distant mailing address could allow you to ignore paying those parking ticket fees and be immune from having your license and non-MA registration suspended in punishment until you finally paid the tickets off. It was particularly bad to be caught with a discordant MA in-state Drivers License and a car registered outside-of-MA – i know of 2 persons who because of this DL/registation mismatch problem (and maybe/probly some unpaid ticket(s) too), were both arrested in MA on the spot + immediately put in jail – one who was stopped for driving too fast in a school zone on a MA road + was taken away in the police car + her car was towed away – even worse, the other person was actually at home + confronted inside his apartment by police at the door with an arrest warrent + taken roughly away in handcuffs + held until he got to court. Being one of the thousands of students and other young people in-training in Boston, many of whom are out-of-state in origin and alleged to be irresponsible about parking tickets, didn’t help these victims. And now the police have cuffs that clamp onto your wheels, too. ouch. Also, besides Montana, haven’t other states have had registration loop-holes too, maybe VT? Had a friend in CT who registered his car on Rt 1 in Alabama. And there seems to be a lot of FL plates around, too.
In the mid-80s, it was very common for people in New Jersey to register cars in Florida or North Carolina. The problem then was that auto insurance was very expensive in NJ, compared to many other States. Of course, you had to have a second home or relatives in the other States to get this to work.
Over the years, the insurance problems got ironed out, and now it’s rare to see Florida or Carolina plates around here. I’m sure there were other factors involved as well.
FL plates in northeastern states are likely snowbirds. People that have a home/condo in FL and purchase and register their car in Florida. You pay sales tax on the purchase and then just registration thereafter Its way cheaper than the tax hungry states up north. If you have two homes in 2 locations and reside in both states for periods of time. The state may try but I figure if you spend more time in FL you can tell MA to go to hell.
My neighbor in MA bought a condo in FL. Being retired, they can live in FL for 6 months + a day, and they don’t have to pay MA taxes. They just have to keep track of the number of days they reside in FL. If MA wasn’t so greedy, people wouldn’t be looking for ways to avoid being ripped off.
It is actually worse than you mention. When I moved to Texas from Maryland, to re-register my cars and motorcycle Texas wanted to charge me sales tax all over again! That is DOUBLE taxation; so I just ran my Maryland plates. All of these bogus state laws are merely ways to raise funds. Texas has no state income tax; hence they stick it to you by other means! I don’t have an issue w Montana plates. I just wish you would NOT write about it!!
OR… You could take the effort you put into dodging the rules and instead make moves to change the rules.
If you disagree with a law, it doesn’t mean you get to ignore it. Work to change the law to make it fair. Be a positive change rather than a scab on society
I dont know, I heard a story once about some guys that threw a load of tea into a harbor in order to thumb thier nose at a rule/law. I dont think they were scabs. Seems like this has been a normal way to respond to get a point across for a long time. Change what you can when you can, but refuse to participate in some things as a protest if you feel you must.
By the same logic you cite, guards at death camps should have petitioned their government to have a meeting to vote on changing what was going on instead of just opening the gates. Of course thats a very dramatic example, which is what your supposed to do to find out if something holds water. What it shows is that you could be right in your statement, and I am right in the above, so that means is there is a line in there somewhere where civil disobedience or a disregard for doing something that is stupid or wrong can occur and is the right choice of action. Each individual figures out where that line is for them and acts accordingly.
I dont have a problem with someone dodging taxes that I dont think should exist anyway. Bully for them. If the state doesnt like it they can (1) crack down, which will either solve the issue or create a larger problem, or (2) they can recognize maybe the taxes they have are not the best way to deal with it. We are OVER TAXED left and right, taxed on money that is taxed and will continue to be taxed. Good on Montana for taking advantage of it.
“By the same logic you cite, guards at death camps should have petitioned their government to have a meeting to vote on changing what was going on instead of just opening the gates.”
Nope. That is not even remotely a fair comparison and saying such proves you aren’t here to discuss in good faith. I can maybe jive with your Boston Tea Party reference, but that would mean you are prepared to secede over vehicle registration prices? More power to you.
People who think the way you are posting are the worst. Want to complain but won’t actually do anything to help the situation your complaining about. If you want to pay Montana tax rates on your cars then GO LIVE IN MONTANA. It’s that simple.
There are three very simple paths that aren’t tax dodging:
-live where you are and pay those taxes
-go live where the taxes are what you want
-work to change the taxes where you are to fit what you desire
Of course it is a fair comparison, and I am arguing in good faith. It shows an extreme example of the same spectrum, which is required to test an argument. Thats ‘problem-solving 101’.
So agree to disagree there Randy, but I wont disparage you. Some of us just are not automatically rule followers and are more disagreeable than others. All of use who live in America have disagreeable people to thank. And while we cant be contrary to everything all of the time, there is a ‘healthy’ amount of disagreeableness required to remain a free people. You have to live in a country with people like me, because America is the only free country, or was, whatever your opinion might be, and that is both because of, and also creates people like me. This same disagreeableness will exist in certain people (like myself) in both important and unimportant discussions, but then we use reason to decide how to behave. Of course I dont personally believe in overthrowing the country over vehicle registration taxes, thats a real leap to say, but to that point, I think it is interesting to consider that our forefathers overthrew a country over essentially a tea tax, and one that (percentage-wise) was extremely trivial when compared to what we pay today. We are overtaxed, and we are putting up with more than we should because we have a normalcy bias and are perhaps too conflict avoidant. So while I register my cars in my state and dont do the Montana thing, I wont demonize those who take advantage of loopholes. There will always be people who will cheat for the sake of cheating, but thats a smaller percentage of people and not what I think we are discussing.
How do they know you didn’t purchase it from out of state? Would be cheaper to retitle in another state then “bring” it back in.
You Americans are taxed below almost everyone else in the developed world. Crybabies.
Enjoy your socialism.
Well, yes, thank you, we do.
No, the Boston Tea Party was not an anti-tax protest — sorry. It was about political representation. Their goal was not to avoid paying taxes. It was to set, levy, and collect their own taxes for their own use.
Your analogy of the Boston Tea Party has a fatal flaw, that being that it was about “taxation without representation”. The previous commentor was saying that you can can work to change the law through your representatives. That is what America is founded on. We are represented by people elected by us.
Yea, well just check and see what taxes those representatives are paying. Funny how all those loopholes work for them. Do you know any that are not millionaires after being in congress a few years?
Thank you. Glad to see someone else gets it.
I live in Oregon and for years I enjoyed two year registrations for only $30. That has changed, but even with the increased fee, it’s so much better than so many states, especially the state due south of us. I really feel for drivers in some states. I have a friend that works hard at two jobs and cannot afford a new car because of the taxes and fees. We ARE taxed too much here in the U.S., way too much. I understand the need to maintain the roads, but so much of the general funds of most state’s budgets are completely wasted on programs that should be either curtailed or eliminated. If that was done, then states could lower the taxes and fees on not just vehicles, but other items as well. There’s a saying, give a politician a dime and they’ll spend a dollar.
agree. Sounds like some states are just punishing you for having a car. Ohio is decent about it, about 60 a yr. for plates, no E check after 25 years.
I have a residence in Ohio, where I work, and one in another state. The car(s) I have in Ohio are registered in Ohio, and the cars in another state are registered in that state. Ohio is reasonable – if not inexpensive – on registration. Electric cars do get an additional registration fee, as they do not contribute to road taxes that are in the fuel tax. Not saying any is right or wrong, just indicating the facts in this situation.
Agreed re the “not write about it”.
It’s an interesting but unproductive article
As a California resident, let’s just say there’s no evidence that the (big) sky high taxes that are extorted from the residents actually helps the same in any measurable way.
Similar to the reality that most private jets have registered owners as corporations in Delaware. However, that is more for potential liability than tax evasion. Perhaps if states did not use vehicles as a vehicle for unfair taxation, then owners would not be so creative in avoidance. In my state, the various city / county and the state gets all of the appropriate sales taxes, collected by the dealer, at time of purchase, followed by a yearly system of decreasing fees for every year of registration, seems fair. However, lots of states charge sales taxes every time a vehicle changes ownership, unlike every other possession, that is only taxed once at initial retail purchase, not really fair.
Indiana works similarly to this. One gripe I have though, is that we pay excise tax every year. That should be a one-time tax in my opinion. Also, sales tax on used things is BS. Sales tax was already paid when the item was new, why is it required again?
If the politicians weren’t actively trying to bleed everyone dry constantly we wouldn’t need to do this.
Ohio you can get a permanent historical plate. Possibly in Michigan if not your dayly driver. Take it to car shows and get dash places for a few. Should any law officers ask, you’re doing a maintenance check it’s legal and necessary.
Same in New Jersey.
Same in Wisconsin, except in WI it must be 20 years old and can’t be driven in January, (Collector Plates).
My 79 VW has Idaho antique plates (I live in Idaho). When I lived in Virginia, the car aged to the point where it was eligible for antique plates. if you’re not commuting in it, it’s a no-brainer.
Same here in PA. I got Historic plates for my 60+ old car, but there are restrictions on driving it. I only paid 1 time and the plates and registration are good for as long as I own the car and I don’t have to do any inspections on it either.
Even our politicians do this. Remember John Kerry was trying to register his multimillion-dollar sailboat and tried to register it in another state. Someone found out and then he said it was a mistake. All of the tax codes have loopholes in them. The richer you are the better tax lawyer you have to find them.
What is the average cost of establishing an LLC in Montana and for having a $300,000 vehicle registered/plated there, from a remote state? Perhaps these LLC mills are the biggest beneficiaries, while the DMVs in Montana and the “home” state are the most impacted.
For a $300K vehicle, it would be >$2K the first year. Annual LLC fees and state filing forms every year after that.
Plus the agent for service fee, and state and federal income tax filings.
Montana is aware of the out of state issue and requires an applicant to file in person, not by mail, although you can appoint a power of attorney to file for you. But this all costs money.
Most LLC from out of state use an agent. The agent does all the work for a fee. State taxes-if you don’t create any income you don’t pay. Renewal fees for LLC’s around $20-50 bucks a year. These LLC’s are a pain in the ### 🙂
They range from $750 to $3k, depends on who you’re using for your registered agent. A law firm charges the most. The plate fees vary from county to county with some counties adding a RHET tax, this adds to the plate cost. Reach out to a Montana resident who understands all side of the LLC formation, Plus the insurance side . Knowing the facts from truthful source will help you decide if the LLC formation in Montana is right for you: llc406mt@gmail.com